6 replies to this topic

[HUEHUE]

I will use this topic to frequently suggest balancing and ideas for other new things.

 

For those of you who dont know me: IВґm HUEHUE aka buni/b000ny and I have played lod on and off even before it came to RGC. IВґm a rather close mate to ResQ and used to be a betatester for normal Dota 1. I have a decent grasp of gamesense and know my drill around balancing and hero/spell concepts. If anybody cares I play Dota 2 semi-competitively as a fullsupport player with my Team playing in the 2nd highest division of european Dota.

 

First off lets start with something that seems minor.

 

Space Orc

 

This originally was intended as a jokemodel for the Warcraft 3 Campaign. ItВґs  animated quite decently and has good textures. But what itches is the state of the hero in the current LoD Map.

 

Space Orc is the only melee hero that exceeds the attack range of 200 and has a arguebly strong skillset if rolled. Every Spell this hero offers is really strong if used properly. I wonВґt even go into detail about how broken his ultimate and Urna Swarm can be, but rather focus on the model:

 

It has a considerably weak statgain, afaik the weakest in the game as of now, but I still rate it as too strong as the model offers too much for its buck.

 

Some balancing approaches:

 

-Attack Range reduced from 300 to 200

-Base Attack Damage reduced by 8

 

This is a quite decent nerf which doesnt take away too much of its creativity, if you however dont want to change the Attack Range because of "MUH UNIQUE MODEL" go and nerf the stats even further. I think we should get the stats on the same lvl that Slark for example has in normal Dota / Dota 2 (no stat exceeds a gain of 1.9 or higher).

 

 

Some other things:

 

-Change the maximum amount of stuns to 2 per Hero and include slows/movement hindering spells into that list. This would make games far more interesting again and actually enable more spellcasting heroes outside of Multicast spam.

 

-I donВґt agree with some balance changes and leftovers of the heroclass Era that draco and ResQ tried to force down our Throats. Some Models are considerably stronger than others because of what seems minor tweaks. Probably remove most of the BAT buffs because it puts heroes like Furion or Storm into a hilarious position where they exceed the carry possibility of Agility heroes. Same goes for Lina who is really strong as of now.

 

-The Sieger Model is one of the newbees as well, and has too high statgain for a model with its advantages.

 

 

I also am working on a Hero Concept for a Mortar Model. Hold your breath .

 

 

Yarni and Larni - Mortar Team

 

Strength: 23 +2.3

Agility: 14 + 1.3

Intelligence: 19 + 2.1

 

Basedmg: 36-44

Base Armor: 3

Attack Range: 650

BAT of 1.6

 

Everything else is to be handled by ResQ.

 

Skillset:

 

Disengage: The Mortar Team uses a bomb of its own to detonate and force themselves back while enemies in the area take Damage and get pushed in the opposite direction

 

Level 1: Deals 80 Damage and pushes the Mortar 250 range back/ enemies 250 range in the opposite direction

Level 2: Deals 120 Damage and pushes the Mortar 350 range back/ enemies 350 range in the opposite direction

Level 3: Deals 160 Damage and pushes the Mortar 450 range back/ enemies 450 range in the opposite direction

Level 4 :Deals 200 Damage and pushes the Mortar 550 range back/ enemies 550 range in the opposite direction

 

Cooldown: 30/26/22/18

Manacost: 120 at all levels

Damage Type: Magical

 

Hint: This spell is self casted like Leap providing a 0.1s invulnerable timer to disengage projectiles and enemies are always thrown into the opposite direction of what theyВґre looking at. May be multicasted to increase range and damage resulting in hilarious stuff.

 

Solar Flare: The Mortar fires a colorful rocket up in the air to see his foes.

 

Casting Range: Global

 

 

Level 1: Grants 700 flying vision around the area of impact and reveals invisible units for 4 seconds.

Level 2: Grants 800 flying vision around the area of impact and reveals invisible units for 6 seconds.

Level 3: Grants 900 flying vision around the area of impact and reveals invisible units for 8 seconds.

Level 4: Grants 1000 flying vision around the area of impact and reveals invisible units for 10 seconds.

 

Additional Info: The Flare is casted instantly and provides vision for its duration. Flares are attackable and can be destroyed after 4/5/6/7 hero attacks. Grants +25 bounty.

 

Cooldown: 40/30/20/10 seconds.

Manacost: 100/90/80/70

 

Notes: This Spell should have the normal flare animation that gyrocopters had in war3 with a bit of a travel time.

 

Mortar Bomb: The Mortar team prepares a devastating Rocket which will deal damage upon impact and scatter into smaller parts which will detonate if an enemy steps upon them.

 

Casting Range: 1000

Channeling Time: 2 seconds

AoE: 600

Center AoE: 200

 

Level 1: The Rocket deals 200 damage if the rocket hits an enemy direclty. Damage reduces significantly if enemies are further away. Spawns 3 Scatters each dealing 25 damage.

Level 2: The Rocket deals 300 damage if the rocket hits an enemy direclty. Damage reduces significantly if enemies are further away. Spawns 3 Scatters each dealing 50 damage.

Level 3: The Rocket deals 400 damage if the rocket hits an enemy direclty. Damage reduces significantly if enemies are further away. Spawns 3 Scatters each dealing 75 damage.

Level 4: The Rocket deals 600 damage if the rocket hits an enemy direclty. Damage reduces significantly if enemies are further away. Spawns 3 Scatters each dealing 100 damage.

 

Damage Type:  Mixed

 

Manacost: 80/120/140/180

Cooldown: 16/14/12/10 seconds.

Additional Info: Scatters will spawn randomly in the AoE and are invisible. Upon channeling the spell will go on cooldown.

 

 

ItВґs Sieging Time: Yarni and Larni enter full serious mode and rig up their strongest weapons.This Spell is a ranged Transformation

 

Level 1: Global Attack Range. Unit cannot move (100% slowed) Attack Type changes to Siege Damage. Increases Damage by 60. Lasts for 4 Hits or 25 seconds

Level 1: Global Attack Range. Unit cannot move (100% slowed) Attack Type changes to Siege Damage. Increases Damage by 80. Lasts for 5 Hits or 25 seconds

Level 1: Global Attack Range. Unit cannot move (100% slowed) Attack Type changes to Siege Damage. Increases Damage by 100. Lasts for 6 Hits or 25 seconds

 

Manacost: 150

Cooldown: 200/180/160

Hero gets held in Place while in Siegeform and cannot profit from Item modifications (crits, orbs)

[Hillomunkki]

leaker creater

 

also orc firebat is not a joke model, neither is veno aka hydralisk

 

-Change the maximum amount of stuns to 2 per Hero and include slows/movement hindering spells into that list. This would make games far more interesting again and actually enable more spellcasting heroes outside of Multicast spam.

 

The issue is more about the balance behind the abilities in regular dota. Sven for example has a piss poor mana pool and can barely afford to use his stun and warcry without going completely oom. Then in comes Dark Seer/Jakiro with 500 mana pool and 0.2 cast point and wohoo the balance goes out the window. Same thing with Fissure and other abilities, they simply aren't balanced at all on different heroes. Shadow Dance and Essence Shift are probably among the most powerful abilities in the game and to compensate for that Slark has reaaaaally poor starting stats and gains. 

 

Takes more than that to fix the underlying issue.

[Whiteboard]

*****

-Change the maximum amount of stuns to 2 per Hero and include slows/movement hindering spells into that list. This would make games far more interesting again and actually enable more spellcasting heroes outside of Multicast spam.

****

I strongly oppose this proposal. For a charming reply, I know how players works. They find every advantage they can and exploit it for profit. It is the inherit nature of playing a game. And other things while at it, but focusing on lod atm.

 

The inevitable outcome of raising the cap by 1 (total 2) while including slows/snares (Snares are already counted as a disable: fyi) is that people will disregard slows for another stun. Which leads to mandatory BKB or a relative response in it's kind to chainstunning/locking ubernuking people whilst disabled to oblivion.

 

And at that point, you get a game based on timers. You start yours and you move in to deal damage. When it ends, you start a new timer or fuck off to remain safe.

 

That is the power of disables. All else becomes moot. Timers, people edging out of cast ranges and whoring with vision/wards to get first strike with their timer.

Facerolling in short, when the timing comes. When positioning allows it.

 

This is my philosophy. I've come to understand it over the years of moba's i've played. Power > All. And disables equals power, best working in conjunction with damage dealing. (Damage also counts towards your power at disposal.)

 

It's alot to be said about a simple proposal and I do have more. But i'll stop at that.

 

Verdict: Proposition declined.

 

---

 

Minus the hero being a rip of Ziggs from LoL (with a nonlethal cluster rocket for vision) I'd enjoy more content in the map.

At the moment I personally want the staff to prioritize the stability of the map (May of course have this hero concept as a work in progress, but to be implemented after a stable map has been established).

 

Verdict: Approved (But delayed per implementation).

 

- Sincerely, Whiteboard.

[MintberryCrunch]

Lets welcome the new overlord spell; ItВґs Sieging Time if you deside to make it work with items and other abilities. I'm HIGHLY looking forward to the most broken spell in resqlodo.

[HUEHUE]

Time to dig this up, ResQ pls gibe Mortar Team.

 

No hands aside IВґve had my fair share of Lod lately and played it to a big success and noticed a lot of spells are lacking while others completely dominate the games. We need some balance approaches to get rid of a lot of stuff.

Here is my opinion on how LoD works currently. There are 2 playstyles which are very dominant and can dictate games if pulled off properly. One is an incredibly aggressive pushing/ganking playstyle with one backup carry to farm, this carry probably will never have the impact he should have but the other 4 heroes make up for that by opressing the whole other team who has a hard time reacting to the aggression since they relied too much on strategy #2 : Passive farming up to a certain point / core item where you just steamroll any enemy resistance. The items attributing to this are things like Bloodstone, Lothars, Dagger, Radiance, Aghanims and sometimes Sange and Yasha. If you manage to obtain unobscured farm and have the right skillcomposition you will snowball the game completely if you are a somewhat decent player.

 

If neither of the strategies are pursued the game will end up in a vicious farmfest where the one with the tankiest build will come out on top and eventually win the game if there are no grave mistakes they have made.

 

There is quite some controversy that comes with this opinion as no player is without mistakes and other factors need to be calculated in such as if theres a support hero that actively controls vision or if the player having a snowballing hero sucks balls or gets opposed in his lane by another strong build, but in general this is what it comes down to.

 

A lot of games are decided by builds and some skills are just retardedly strong compared to others. Tankspells in general often make squishy snowball heroes close to unkillable resulting in a much easier snowball. Skills that do that are Lone Druids Bear Form, Kraken Shell, Berserkers Blood, Abaddon Ult and Reincarnation for example. A noteworthy mention should go out to Pulse Nova and Freezing Field but those are skills that scale way too good with other tank spells which arent necessarily ultimates such as Unstable Current or Corrosive Skin. The thing is that there are other tankspells which are only very rarely picked which points out the dominance that those spells put up. Simply because they are not balanced around Lod, they are balanced around the model they were assigned to in dota. Skeleton King isnt that scary with Reincarnation as a hero with 3 other highly offensive skills are, the aghanims effect making it even more broken.

 

I think IВґve ranted enough and most of you got my point so here are the actual suggestions:

 

-Reincarnation no longer triggers when the target is silenced and respawns heroes with 25/50/75% (50/75/100% with aghs) of their max hp and mana upon triggering.

-True Form no longer gives bonus HP unless picked with Synergy (Now as Synergy upgrade) / Option 2: True Form now has a set duration of 40/60/80 seconds with a cooldown of 300/240/180 seconds

-Borrowed Time cooldown increased to 100/80/60 seconds / Suggestion 2 : While borrowed time is active the every dmg the hero deals is reduced by 30%

-Reverted Kraken Shell to its original form (minus the stacking with Stout Shield)

-Exorcism spirits can now be affected by AoE Effects (Stuns, Slows)

-Exorcism healing reduced by 50% on all lvls

-Berserker Rage no longer gives bonus HP

-Pulse Nova now costs 200/180/160 to activate

-Craggy Exterior now works regardless of range and deals 25/50/75/100 dmg if it triggers

-Natural Order reduction reduced to 20/40/60/80%

-Unstable current now purges for 1 second on all levels

-Devour manacost increased to 120/100/80/60

-Scorched Earth now only heals for half the damage done

-Scorched Earth Damage increased to 20/25/30/35

-Reactive Armor stacks now last 25 seconds

-Gravekeepers Cloak recovery time improved to 10/8/6/4

-Sleight of Fist damage increased to 30/60/90/120

-Windrunner (Spell) now applied phased to the hero

-Windrunner cooldown increased by 3 seconds

-Urna Swarm no longer requires corpses to be summoned

 

 

Mind that these changes are not set in stone and numbers are adjustable, its just a general consensus on how the map could be changed. Most of these changes are rather minor and shouldnt have too much impact on the game, it should just give a general direction.

 

If you have any further balance suggestions feel free to state them here, Im also open to your critics.

 

Thanks for reading,

 

HUEHUE aka 4Head

 

 

 

[Entrails]

I like the mortar hero but his ult + thirst and rearm is plain outbalanced. and since if the agi is low just add a little more base damage to compensate around 45-55

[Meatmuffin]

^ just dont allow rearm and its sieging time? duh